Bad arguments and tantrums

So a man-child who I am an aquantance with was posting on his page combined with a rant about the disrespect of people suggesting the rememberance day poppy be changed to white instead of red to avoid the whole red=violence and bad stuff thing.

It just so happens that I agree in principal with his argument that it should remain red.
His argument however, was just as spurious and not seated in reality as the disrespectful jerkoffs in the article.

Now my aquantance’s argument, although emotionally satisfying was no more reality based and no stronger than the jackoff in the article. And that was that it was red because war is about violence, period, end of story.

So, being the egomaniacal, self centred jerk that I am, I pointed out that while I agree that is a nice reason to keep the red. It’s not really THE reason, it’s not the reason red poppies were chosen, and it’s no more valid a reason to keep the red than jackoff’s reason to make it white.

The reason to keep it red, is the reason the red poppy was selected in the first place.
The poem, “In Flanders Fields”.
Evidenced here
At this my aquantance flipped his stack, swearing up and down that the poem has nothing to do with it, and couldn’t possibly because it was written about WW 1 (Which, incidentally is correct, it was written about WW 1 and not WW 2.
But then, that is irrelevant. Rememberance day is NOT specifically about WW 2. It is about WAR period. War and the soldiers we ask to serve their country.
Soldiers that commit love and often their lives to that cause.
Soldiers that we should remember. Because in doing so we remember the cost and horrors of war, we remember the sacrifices those who die have made for those who survive to live the lives we live.

It is important to remember these things. It is important to recognise and respect them.
Vacuiously stamping your feet and throwing a tantrum because you are told you are using a bad argument, is not being respectful.

The problem with my aquantance’s argument, while, like I said, emotionally satisfying. Is that by the same logic, I could argue that we should in fact use a red rose.
Red to reflect the violence and bloodshed, a rose because it reflects the love of the soldiers who died for their country, and the love we should hold for them, and because the shape of a rose is like that of an explosion, also reflecting the horror of war. And roses have thorns, a very tactile reminder of the pain of loss.

Of course, this bears no resemblance at all to the REAL reason we don’t use roses, and that we DO use red poppy flowers. But the logic for that is just as strong as for the idea that my aquantance put forward. And just as divorced from the reality of why the red poppy was chosen.

Had John McCray written about white poppies on flanders fields, we would today be wearing white poppies in rememberance. As with Orange, or Black, or even blue. The logical and sound argument requires you return to the roots of the decision.
If the reason for that decision has not changed, then the decision should not change.

Apparently there was a debate a few years ago proposing white poppies in order to save money for the organisations that made them.
This argument has more merit than my aquantance’s argument about keeping the red poppy. However it does not really stack up against the reality based reason to keep the red poppy.

And I am sure you are all waiting with baited breath to hear the conclusion to this little tale of toddler level misery.
Well, to be fair, I do not know if that story is done yet. But at this point, the aquantance in question has taken his bucket and shovel, and stomped off from the sandbox.

Endlessly amusing, especially since this aquantance is rather prone to making completely uninformed accusations of a rather derrogitory nature toward family members of mine.

As it turns out, If you are reading this. Your protest about me not knowing more about the poppy tradition than you, just because you spent some time in the military. happened to be as spurious and garbage filled as your argument that started this whole thing. It turns out I DID know more about the rememberance day poppy than you.

And the best bit, IF you have the maturity to have sucked up your bruised pride to read this far. NOW YOU KNOW SOMETHING YOU DIDN’T BEFORE!!

You should also know something new, non-poppy related too, but to spell it out for you. When dealing with me, temper tantrums don’t work.


~ by scawalrus on November 7, 2013.

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